The Emerging "Geoweb" -The World Map as Living Organism
Astro-Engineering Artifacts as Evidence of

Cosmic "X" or God? -Religion vs Science

Religion_vs_science_1Science vs. Religion seems to be a running theme for the 21st century. Yet, the two sides of the debate have much in common. Not being willing to consider other's perspective is a common occurrence in both worlds.

Why does the universe seem so fine-tuned for the emergence of life, including intelligent life capable of asking that "why" question? "Believers," says theoretical physicist and astrobiologist, Paul Davies, in a recent interview with Cosmic Log, "simply say that God did it, while scientists are trying to come up with complicated extradimensional multiverse theories to explain our lucky break."

Many scientists cling to their theories as faithfully as the devout cling to their religious texts. In both realms, to point out that an underlying concept does not appear to make sense can be taken as blasphemy. In both camps there are sharp internal divides as to what should be accepted as "truth."

In his new book, Cosmic Jackpot, Davies end runs the religious question by taking a completely different tack. He argues that the cosmos has made itself the way it is, stretching backward in time to the very beginning to focus in on a biological universe of what he calls "bio-friendliness."

The concept of a biological universe requires as profound a revision in our thinking about the cosmos as the Copernican and Dawrinian revolutions. It is a worldview that states that planetary systems are common, that life originates wherever conditions are favorable, and that evolution culminates with intelligence.

The most eloquent description of the bio-friendly universe came from Nobel laurate Christian de Duve who wrote that "The universe is not the inert cosmos of the phyicist, with a little added life for good measure. The universe is life, with the necessary infrastructure around it; it consists foremost of trillions of bioshperes generated and sustained by the rest of the universe."

According to Davies there are three popular responses to the fact that the universe does seem to be weirdly fine-tuned for life: the intelligent-design argument; the idea that if we had a final theory of physics, then all of the undetermined parameters in the laws would be fixed by that theory; and the third is the multiverse or the notion that there is a multiplicity of universes, with laws that vary from one to the other.

All three of these explanations are found wanting, writes Davies, who's view is that the universe has engineered its own bio-friendliness through a sort of feedback loop that operates in both directions in time.

For most people, the first interpretation is, 'Well, God did it.' "The problem with saying God did it," says Davies, "is that God is unexplained, so you are appealing to an unexplained designer. It doesn't actually explain anything; it just shoves the problem off. But to say that the laws of physics just happen to permit life is no explanation either."

The true and ultimate debate clincher might belong to the Michael Shermer, author of the "Skeptic" column for Scientific Amerian, who played on Arthur C. Clarke's famous Third Law: "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic" to coin Shermer's Last Law:

"Any sufficiently advanced extraterrestrial intelligence is indistinguishable from God."

But, perhaps it's best if we end with thoughts of the greatest scientic mind in human history: When he turned 50, Einstein granted an interview in which he was asked point-blank, whether he believed in God.

"I am not an atheist," he began. "The problem involved is too vast for our limited minds. We are in the position of a little child entering a huge library filled with books in many languages. The child knows someone must have written those books. It does not know how. It does not understand the languages in which they are written. The child dimly suspects a mysterious order in the arrangement of the books but doesn't know what it is. That, it seems to me, is the attitude of even the most intelligent human being toward God. We see the universe marvelously arranged and obeying certain laws but only dimly understand these laws."

Posted by Casey Kazan with Rebecca Sato

Related Galaxy Posts:

Origin of Religion -Human Brain as a "Belief Engine"

Darwin's God -The Legacy of the HMS Beagle

Neurotheology -Is God Hardwired in the Human Brain

Sources:

Christian de Duve Interview

Link: The Cosmic Log -The Self-made Universe

Shermer's Last Law

Story Link: James Gardner The Intelligent Universe

Comments

The title of the article is a bit misleading, though it is a good article. Einstein was pro the notion of God or, more accurately, was agnostic towards the idea of a creative intelligence - he was simply against religions that attempt to box that creative intelligence into their little models of the universe and try to push it off as the gospel truth. But, he never said any where wrong, just that he did not share those viewpoints. He was however more of an advocate of the concept of a Universal Mind. So the title 'Einstein' or 'God' really makes no sense, as Einstein was for God, not against.
Nice article though.

Cheers.

Dear fauX: I know, I wrestled with the title put came up empty. Will give it another shot this a.m. Thnx...Casey

Have Your Say Pakistan Tribune


Global environmental collapse - how & why! Logical proof of Allah & Pantheism. ______________ John Berbatis, Australia (2007-03-26 15:20:41)

Dear Editor,

Syllogisms that I submitted in 1998, which were recognized by the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights - Dr Mary Robinson and the Hon. Justice Michael D. Kirby AC CMG of the High Court of Australia.


Time must exist before matter can be created, and only an animate entity can conceive of space-time. Time must be a stabilized and uniform condition before matter can form, thus Monotheism is a Truth.

The Universe consists of space-time; which is functionally active and growing but remains stable. These combined characteristics are indicative of an animate entity only, thus Pantheism is a fact. Consequently, all mortals' behaviour and attitudes become conspicuous by our Creator.

Reality is the dream of a Universal sentient being; sensations of all mortals are merely light flashes within elongated fractal crystals, flowing in a white mist which is time itself; ensconced within a beige coloured and velvet textured Pearl, i.e., a holographic Universe.

If all electrical particles were in different time zones - matter would not form, thus time is a controlled electromagnetic radiation (energy) E = mc2.

To be perfect - one must know the past, present and future, there is only one, the one that created Time.

John Berbatis Perth, Australia March 26th, 2007

Tel: +61 0422621382 Email: johnberbatisau@hotmail.com


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Global environment collapse. ______________ John Berbatis, Australia (2007-03-26 15:15:01)

Many citizens of earth do not realize the seriousness of the parlous state of the global environment, but will just prior to their obliteration by 'a raging mother nature'. Judging by the current extremes of global weather conditions and the recent increase in worldwide seismic activity, I believe humanity will face extinction before the end of 2008.

In the past ten years there has been an exponential melting of the ice sheets and a noticeable disintegration of the ice shelves, owing to 'global warming'.
The loss of mass from the underlying Tectonics Plates causes them to ascend (iso-static rebound), and this results in an increase in the intensification and frequency of global seismological activity. The seismic data of the past ten years confirm this conjecture. Furthermore, the ice shelves impede the flow of glaciers and ice sheets into to the oceans; and when the 'polar regions' are subjected to unprecedented seismic upheavals, these events will then cause the ice sheets and glaciers to be dislodged en masse into the oceans. This occurrence will then instantly destabilize the earth's surface weight distribution (isostasy), and so precipitate a 'crust displacement' (Mag. 12). i.e., axis change! The previous subterranean extraction of fossil fuels will greatly exacerbate this impending Apocalypse.
Currently, the excessive amount of carbon and methane gasses in the atmosphere is causing catastrophic weather conditions, globally - and this situation will rapidly deteriorate... 'a climate runaway!'
The global environmental and geo-political situations are now coalescing into a 'critical mass'; so I believe humanity can expect a catastrophe of worldwide proportions within this year!
In 1998, I submitted my dissertation on the above matter to various eminent institutions and individuals, to which I received positive responses from PM's Tony Blair, Helen Clark (NZ) & Lee Kwain Yew (Singapore) as well as the UN's - Dr Mary Robinson, Hon. Justice Michael Kirby AC CMG of the High Court of Australia, Premier P. Beattie (Queensland, Au) and Chief Justices of Canada, Norway, Taiwan, Mexico and Netherlands etc,.

Reality rules this universe! ... not unproductive discussion & debate?

John Berbatis
4/21 Cornelian St
Scarborough 6019
Perth Australia Tel: +61 0422621382 July 6th, 2007



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Ackerley, Beth"
To: "John Berbatis"
Subject: Tsunami SMS Warnings
Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2007 11:50:53 +1000

Mr John Berbatis
Email address: johnberbatisau@hotmail.com

Dear Mr Berbatis

The Premier, Paul Lennon MHA, has asked me to acknowledge and

thank you for your email of 29 March 2007 in relation to Tsunami SMS warning.

Yours sincerely

Beth Ackerley
Executive Officer
Premier's Office
Telephone: 6233 6068
Fax: 6234 1572
Email: Beth.Ackerley@dpac.tas.gov.au

From :
thepremier

Sent :
Tuesday, 13 March 2007 2:00:16 PM

To :


Subject :
AA07/06566 - Global warming


From : thepremier
Sent : Tuesday, 13 March 2007 2:00:16 PM
To : johnberbatisau@hotmail.com
Subject : AA07/06566 - Global warming

Dear Mr Berbatis


The Premier has received your recent email concerning global warming.

Your views have been noted and Mr Iemma the appreciates reasons which prompted you to write to him on this occasion.

You may be sure that your comments will receive close consideration.


Yours sincerely

Jocelyn Mouawad
Assistant Private Secretary

From: WA-Government
Sent: Tuesday, 10 April 2007 4:13:08 PM
To : "john berbatis"
Subject : RE: SMS alerts for tsunami warning.

| | | Drafts | Inbox


Dear Mr Berbatis

We refer to your recent email regarding SMS alerts for tsunami warnings.

Your suggestion has been noted and forwarded to the Hon John Kobelke, Minister
for Police and Emergency Services for consideration.

Regards
WA Govt

>>> "john berbatis" 5/04/07 9:30 am >>>
Dear Premier Alan Carpenter,

In last month, there has been a heightened level of global seismological
activity, especially in the Pacific basin 'ring of fire'; and it appears to be
substantially escalating.
I have recommended by email - to all State Premiers, PM Howard and the Chief
Minister Clare Martin, that they consider the immediate establishing of a SMS
alert for a tsunami threat, so as to facilitate the most effective means of the
warning the public.

Kind regards,
John Berbatis
4/21 Cornelian St
Scarborough 6019
Perth WA April 5th, 2007 Tel: 0422621382

NB.
Premier Peter Beattie sent me a positive response by letter, on March 26th 2007
- pertaining to above matter.


From : DP&C
Sent : Thursday, 26 April 2007 11:22:28 AM
To : johnberbatisau@hotmail.com
Subject : State of Global Environment ??Tsunami Warnings by SMS Alerts

| | | Inbox


Doc No: D07/23525

Email response ??Mr John Berbatis

Subject: State of Global Environment ??Tsunami Warnings by SMS Alerts

Dear Mr Berbatis

Thank you for your email to the Premier of 29 March 2007 regarding the
use of SMS alerts for a tsunami threat and the state of the global
environment.

Providing timely emergency warnings and information to communities is a
complex and evolving issue as demonstrated recently following the
Solomon Islands earthquake on 2 April 2007. The Victorian Government
regularly assesses new and emerging technology and systems for public
warning and information, including the use of spatial and
telecommunications technology.

Recognising that climate change requires whole-of-government
consideration, the Premier recently announced the establishment of an
Office of Climate Change to be located within the Department of Premier
and Cabinet. The Office of Climate Change is responsible for supporting
the Premier and the Minister for Water, Environment and Climate Change
in driving a whole-of-government strategic agenda that addresses threats
and explores opportunities of climate change in Victoria and nationally.

The Victorian Government and the Office of Climate Change in particular
are shaping a forward agenda on climate change for the coming years.
Details about Victoria?™s forward agenda will emerge as the work program
develops. This will inevitably require strong collaboration across the
whole of government, business and the community to address this
significant challenge.

I appreciate the information you have provided and your interest in this
matter.

Yours sincerely,

Leo Van Der Toorren
Director
Security and Emergencies

23 April 2007

This Department, in accordance with the Public Records Act 1973, will
collect and store the information you have provided. Should you have
any queries regarding access to your personal information held by this
Department please contact the Privacy Officer, Department of Premier &
Cabinet, Level 2, 1 Treasury Place, East Melbourne 3002.

From : ­є¬Ы©xЄуHP発«H専ҐО Sent : Wednesday, 25 April 2007 8:14:56 AM To : johnberbatisau@hotmail.com Subject : [­є¬Ы©xЄуより] | | | Drafts | Inbox We have received your e-mail.

Best Regard,

E-mail Team
Cabinet Secretariate Government of Japan.



It would be liberating to see the day when science and religion can find a common ground, or at least a neutral place where they can acknowledge and respect each other without making it such a big controversy.

http://www.jerusalemexport.com is a great resource for religious hand crafted wood ornaments and decorative religious products.

How can these two facets meet. For the basis of Science is to discredit GOD and to give credit to mankind. Soon all scientists will recognize that GOD is real and will wish that they believed in something which is real (GOD)rather than a number system which totally against GOD. If as a child you are taught something then by the time you reach adulthood these elements are real and just because you are taught these idiotic rules of science defiles ones intelligence. GOD is real and should be glorified by all mankind including scientist rather than trying to prove there is no GOD

@xxx man:
Scientists don't try to dis-prove god. Scientists examine natural phenomena and try to prove why it happens. The fact that the answer is never "god" isn't scientist's fault, it just so happens that there is no god. And besides, if there was a god, it would be up to the believers to prove his existence. The burden of proof always lies with the accuser.

When Is God-Religion Discussable Scientifically


A. Re "God and Evolution Can Co-Exist, Scientist Insists"

http://www.the-scientist.com/community/posts/list/304.page#1124

- Is there/what is, in the quoted article, a definition of the article's "god" ?

- Specifically, is the article's "god" defined as a human artifact, or not ?
Repeating, with sincere respect:

If “god” is not defined/understood to be a human artifact, its concept is a human virtual reality artifact experienced only through sensory stimuli, and “god-science” is not scientifically discussable. Furthermore, in this case preoccupation with this subject within a scientific frameworks contributes to corrosion and corruption of science and scientism by manifesting or implying acceptance of virtual reality as reality.

Everything is discussable scientifically. No limit. But for scientific discussion the framework must be clearly defined. The totality of subjects that come under the classification "virtual" are not an exception. You can include in the discussion Pavlov and the modes and manners of exploiting virtuality in many areas and towards many ends...


B. "Evolutionary Biology Of Culture And Religion"

http://www.the-scientist.com/community/posts/list/20/122.page#492


C. It's The AAAS That Promotes Religion In Science And In Law

The AAAS and its affiliates and equivalent organizations, i.e. all the Science Establishment Guilds, loudly and pseudoscientifically promote and "profoundly respect" the "spiritual religious domain" as A REAL domain, a domain separate from the REAL, science, domain. They do this both because, unbelievably, they actually believe it and as a politically powerful tool in promoting their power and state-public support.


Dov Henis

(Comments From The 22nd Century)
http://blog.360.yahoo.com/blog-P81pQcU1dLBbHgtjQjxG_Q--?cq=1

Life's Manifest
http://www.the-scientist.com/community/posts/list/112.page#578

It seems that NO-ONE GETS it. Evolution, Creation and the whole theory of how it all began. It is relatively very very simple. Most people "see" God as a humanoid or something but in reality if we disseminate the whole issue, we will verty very self opinionated to think that we are on top of it all. If God was the same as us humans, then we have come to the end of our knowledge. We presently do not even have all the answers with regard to the most basic things in life and God has NO time to be concerned WHAT we know and do not know.
As I have mentioned...It is relatively simple. There is a being...called GOD.....He is SO FAR ahead of us and I am sure has a giggle every so often when we try to explain to ourselves and other about Creation and Evolution but as mentioned...it is very simple....

THER IS A GOD or a being with superior knowledge....Just look at the science around us...SOMEONE or SOMETHING HAD to "create" it....

Creation started LONG before the big bang and will continue LONG after the big crunch.....
If we put it together, it works like this....

God, through EVOLUTION AND CREATION...set it all in motion. Through evolution, everything in our universe was created...By this being or God...Call it evolution or whatever you want to but it WAS and HAD to be done by SOMETHING OR SOMEONE....

Take some bricks, mortar, water, paint, glass panels, electrical conduit etc etc and put it in the desert.........LEAVE it for a few million year and come back...EVEOLUTION tells us that then there will be a beautiful mansion with a swimmingpool and all the luxuries we wish for......CREATION teaches us that UNLESS you or SOMEONE BUILDS this house,.....it will never be.

Final words.....Evolution is part of creation...SOMEONE HAS to build the house.......Someone STARTED it all....That is who God is.....Not just some human or a humanoid creature....God is SO far above us all and it is CRAZY for us to even imagine that we know it all....
Have a great day..

JJ

QUOTE:
"
Take some bricks, mortar, water, paint, glass panels, electrical conduit etc etc and put it in the desert.........LEAVE it for a few million year and come back...EVEOLUTION tells us that then there will be a beautiful mansion with a swimmingpool and all the luxuries we wish for......CREATION teaches us that UNLESS you or SOMEONE BUILDS this house,.....it will never be.
"

Now this is funny...

So you are comparing bricks with organic compounds???
Creation of life was really simple.Put together basic chemicals and give it time in a good environment and within a million years, life is sure to be created.

So where did god exist while creating this universe??Oh I guess this must be a huge science experiment.To see how humans would react if they were put into this kind of a place.

Science is doing its best to explain everything.The only thing that the GOD concept does is say that "HE created it and he is way more intelligent than us and we don't question HIM."

Neither Religion nor Science has the Earth=s true History ALL KNOWED UP.
If you want to believe God Created life on Earth, you are going to have to concede; it took a long time: Evolution is a fact.
But the whole concept of Earth History, as presently being taught in our schools, is nothing more than an elaborate myth.
And the site listed below, will prove it to any open-minded person.
No fees ask or accepted.
All I am trying to peddle is the truth.
And no! I am not a religious zealot.
See: HTTP://GrandpaNate.com/
It is the only true account of our Earth's trek through time, ever written. I DARE YOU TO READ IT.

Discovery Allah/God the Big Bang, Evolution and Gravitation
Allah/God: What is Allah or God? Who is Allah or God? That means many instances such as; A source, Originating cause, First cause, Omnivorous, Nature, Single dimension, Super power, Dark Energy, Black body, Big black hole, A black hole, absolute time sole dimension, sole dimension of power of the things of the universe, great space or the location the center of the connectors between the great world or the great universes, location of the beginning or ending or the most deepest place, same location of place period or the matter, location of the big black hole or primordial black hole or before big bang, huge reserve of the natural force etc, is Allah/the God (Power).
Modern Big Bang Theory: “Beginning of the creation a part of the power of the Allah/God became divisible as a result of the big bang”. At the time of the beginning of the creation or from the absolute zero of time or from the big black hole or from the Nature or From the God, part of the power of the Nature/God/Allah became divisible as a result of the big bang. The part of energy had been divided in the beginning of creation from the large field of energy, which is below 50% of total energy. In the most of natural power reserved in Allah or Nature or Big Black Hole or the God from which, the world of gravitation become influenced.
Modern Evolution Theory: “Everything of the world of matter is the result of evolution from the Allah/God” i.e. everything at all always is changing in the universe. The changing function of everything in the universe is going on always i.e. everything of the real world is always evolving changing and by overcoming the steps of change come various faced physics.
Modern Gravitation Theory: “Gravitational worlds, they are moving or changing the orbit with their all family members depending on the nuclear of each other”. There is the big black hole or Allah or God of the eternal period in the central connection of the space of the universe or there is the huge store of sole level of energy and the place of that absolute time of that huge store is the place of origin or settlement of gravitational force or cosmic ray.

Science very exciting for a religion & a nation- is there a no conflict between science and religious through that physical nature of the Universe. See at https://shahidurrahmansikder.wordpress.com/2010/10/07/294/
God/Allah the Universe and Everything Else
See at https://slashdot.org/submission/6675095/god-the-universe-everything-else
See into: https://plus.google.com/104669722445739033329
New Discovery the Universe: https://shahidurrahmansikder.wordpress.com/tag/god/
Pope: The most important news- about the God, Big Bang & Evolution at https://plus.google.com/104669722445739033329/posts/MQ9wQejCRLQ


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